[FriskyDingo]

Current reports point to the 911 going to a modular platform shared with Audi and Lamborghini with the next gen. At least one source thinks the soon-to-be 992 will debut on it.

https://www.autoblog.com/2018/01/29/...#slide-4962521


There's also talk of a hybrid model. But back to the topic at hand, this really begs a question-


How much further can the 911 go and still be a '911'???


Porsche has been fighting the laws of physics for generations now- with some fair amount of success- but at what point do you reevaluate? Porsche has already moved the engine placement in their RSR racecar forwards to make it more competitive. So they know they are nearing the peak, clearly. What if Porsche condensed the 911 as we know it today and the 718 into one range? Call it the 'Carrera', or come up with a new number name entirely, and have it run from a price point and market role slightly above where the current 718 resides up to a level beyond the current 911 Turbo. The car would be mid-engined, of course, and drop the base flat-4's in favor of 6 and 8's only. RWD or AWD drivetrains of course. They would be able to encompass the entire 911 range as it stands, and it would allow for an even higher up model to do battle with the likes of the 488-successor and McLaren's offerings.

This would then open the door for a new model below the current 718 range. That car has gotten too powerful, and too expensive to serve as a true entry-level Porsche enthusiast car. Such a model needs to start a good 10K less than current base 718 prices. VW never gave us a sports roadster, the TT isn't a proper sportscar, so Porsche needs to fill this role themselves. The Porsche brand was founded in simple, lightweight, proper driver's cars, and there is no reason not to do this. It would not dilute the brand's image, it would capture them an entire new subset of buyers who could become customers for life, and of course it would a profit generator.

And so what of the 911, you ask?? Easy. Porsche is always coming out with ultra-special editions, limited runs, anniversary models, etc, etc to appeal to the 911 faithful and Porsche diehards, they could continue making a 911 in a 'devolved' state. Make the car special again. Core models only- C2, C2S, maybe a C4 and Clubsport or something similar. The cars could be a little more visceral and stripped of some of the detachment that is starting to creep into modern 911's. Limit the production enough, and Porsche could still get away with charging big money for them. Singer finds buyers for half-mil essentially retromod 911's, so there is clearly a market here. Think a more boutique and built-to-order car halfway between the current 911 and something bespoke like a Pagani, etc.


Thoughts??

[Crimson92]

Hybrid
Gt3 going turbo
Modular platform.

Porsche.....you're breaking my heart.

[overcoil]

anyone know how Porsche sales breakdown.

SUV's, sedans, 2-doors. ?

[saeyedoc]

Originally Posted by ScottSinger

anyone know how Porsche sales breakdown.

SUV's, sedans, 2-doors. ?

I don't have the exact numbers handy, but the Macan is #1, followed by the Cayenne. SUVs outnumber sports cars by far.

[FriskyDingo]

Originally Posted by ScottSinger

anyone know how Porsche sales breakdown.

SUV's, sedans, 2-doors. ?

Well, here's 2016 numbers-

https://newsroom.porsche.com/en/comp...ord-13310.html


237,778 sales total worldwide.

Of those, the Macan contributed 95K +, and 911 sales total eclipsed 32 K.

[aozer]

expect prices of current and previous gen 911's to skyrocket even more.

as a lifelong porsche fanboy, this is disappointing. i couldnt care less about all of these ridiculous hypercars (koenigsegg, pagani, lambo, etc). if this really does happen i dont see myself being a car guy for much longer.

[Viffermike]

Yep. Pics have already leaked of the 2019 992 interior, and it shares many of the 2018 Panamera's key features, such as the all-digital dash, the touchscreen, and the stealth center-console touch controls. To me, this is evidence that more important items will also be shared between future Porsche models -- platform key among the possibilities, particularly if/when Mission E bleeds into the meat of the model line, which'll probably happen sooner rather than later.

I think the only way Porsche survives as a sports car maker is if it starts either sharing platforms with itself or with another VW AG entity. (Yes, I'm looking at Audi. It sure as heck ain't gonna be Ducati, or Rolls Royce, or Lambo.) That makes me very, very sad.

[48Laws]

The hamburger hasn’t changed in hundreds of years yet it’s still successful. There’s this imaginary race to keep shareholders happy but we as consumers aren’t in any race. I don’t get it. I laughed at “fair amount of success”. Yes, a bit facetious but you know what i mean.

[RM7]

Originally Posted by 48Laws

The hamburger hasn’t changed in hundreds of years yet it’s still successful.

Egg on top

Cheese inside the hamburger

Bacon inside the hamburger

Pulled pork on top

It'll be interesting to see if the likes of GM with the 1LE/Z06/Grand Sport/ZR-1 variants and the Ford GT350R are pushing the rear-engined chassis to the breaking point. The new corvette may be a nail in the coffin. Porsche knows the mid-engined chassis is a better chassis, but by dumping more and more exotic engineering into it and ever-widening it, it remains relevant, but you need tricks like active swaybars, 4-wheel steering, lower cars that need systems that can raise the front end for daily driving, and awd in some cases, to stay on top. I think the internet and information revolution is just as much to blame as anything else, with everyone in the world, including the manufacturers, able to see and compare cars. So many areas were in a vacuum where the best you knew was the best there is, but in many areas the cat is out of the bag, and any manufacturer with a decent engineering department can make something absolutely amazing these days. As cars get pushed to higher and higher performance though, it likely increases the amount of money that has to be spent on an inferior chassis to keep it on top, vs. dumping that money into a hybrid 918-like setup that can be used to rocket out of corners with brake-energy. Will be interesting to see for sure!

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes

Egg on top

Cheese inside the hamburger

Bacon inside the hamburger

Pulled pork on top

It'll be interesting to see if the likes of GM with the 1LE/Z06/Grand Sport/ZR-1 variants and the Ford GT350R are pushing the rear-engined chassis to the breaking point. The new corvette may be a nail in the coffin. Porsche knows the mid-engined chassis is a better chassis, but by dumping more and more exotic engineering into it and ever-widening it, it remains relevant, but you need tricks like active swaybars, 4-wheel steering, lower cars that need systems that can raise the front end for daily driving, and awd in some cases, to stay on top. I think the internet and information revolution is just as much to blame as anything else, with everyone in the world, including the manufacturers, able to see and compare cars. So many areas were in a vacuum where the best you knew was the best there is, but in many areas the cat is out of the bag, and any manufacturer with a decent engineering department can make something absolutely amazing these days. As cars get pushed to higher and higher performance though, it likely increases the amount of money that has to be spent on an inferior chassis to keep it on top, vs. dumping that money into a hybrid 918-like setup that can be used to rocket out of corners with brake-energy. Will be interesting to see for sure!

I'll blame stability control.

[48Laws]

Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes

Egg on top

Cheese inside the hamburger

Bacon inside the hamburger

Pulled pork on top

And none of those novelties do as well as a regular hamburger. Sure, a Vette being a nail in the coffin for any Porsche is laughable. Amazing what one speculative article can do to erase decades of automotive success.

[RM7]

Originally Posted by 48Laws

And none of those novelties do as well as a regular hamburger. Sure, a Vette being a nail in the coffin for any Porsche is laughable. Amazing what one speculative article can do to erase decades of automotive success.

Dude. Bacon.

[Viffermike]

Originally Posted by 48Laws

And none of those novelties do as well as a regular hamburger. Sure, a Vette being a nail in the coffin for any Porsche is laughable. Amazing what one speculative article can do to erase decades of automotive success.

Sorry, but cheese does (gimme Swiss). As well as bacon. And a fried egg done right. And full-leaf lettuce from the outer half of the head. And 'shrooooms, duuuuude.

The basic hamburger is the original Porsche 911. Add your toppings of choice to arrive at whatever greatness Porsche has created since.

[Chihuahua]

Bun (buttered and grilled)
Grape Jelly
Bacon
Cheddar Cheese
Grass fed ground beef
Peanut Butter
Bun (buttered and grilled)


fin.

[48Laws]

Augmenting a burger, a la cheese etc, is not the same as changing the entire spirit behind what a burger is...which is, beef between to pieces of bread. In order for this to happen... a knew idea or concept would have to replace what a burger is. Occupy its space. That’s never happening and one generation of a Vette surely won’t affect the entire spirit behind Porsche’s legacy or their future.

[Viffermike]

Originally Posted by 48Laws

Augmenting a burger, a la cheese etc, is not the same as changing the entire spirit behind what a burger is...which is, beef between to pieces of bread. In order for this to happen... a knew idea or concept would have to replace what a burger is. Occupy its space. That’s never happening and one generation of a Vette surely won’t affect the entire spirit behind Porsche’s legacy or their future.

Some friendly advice: I wouldn't start an argument about this, man.

First: The hamburger isn't even an American invention -- in fact, no nation can claim it because it came to be aboard late-19th century passenger ships that traveled the Hamburg Line -- much to the chagrin of the many American immigrants who appropriated it and claimed its invention soon afterward.

Also: It's simply an adjustment of other meat-between-bread foods that are centuries older. Two examples: the sandwich (English) and the frankfurter (which dates to the 12th century).

Hence why I'll stick with my Porsche 911 analogy. There were great sports cars before it (and there were great cars before it), and it only got better after its invention.

[48Laws]

Originally Posted by Viffermike

Some friendly advice: I wouldn't start an argument about this, man.

First: The hamburger isn't even an American invention -- in fact, no nation can claim it because it came to be aboard late-19th century passenger ships that traveled the Hamburg Line -- much to the chagrin of the many American immigrants who appropriated it and claimed its invention soon afterward.

The provenance of the hamburger, in this case, is irrelevant. I don't get your google search. lol It's origin was never of topic. What was of topic, is, the burger's relevance and its construction as an anology to the 911's relevance and construction. No one argued where Porsche's are made.

Also: It's simply an adjustment of other meat-between-bread foods that are centuries older. Two examples: the sandwich (English) and the frankfurter (which dates to the 12th century).

That's not true. You cannot put a catfish bewteen two pieces of bread and call it a hamburger. Again, you bring up irrelvant arguments.

Hence why I'll stick with my Porsche 911 analogy. There were great sports cars before it (and there were great cars before it), and it only got better after its invention.

The topic is Porsche's speculative move to a modular system. Who mentioned anything related to great cars before it? Again, one generation of a Vette that may or may not have industry success is not enough to alter the vision of Porsche. Sorry.

[Viffermike]

Originally Posted by 48Laws

The provenance of the hamburger, in this case, is irrelevant. I don't get your google search. lol It's origin was never of topic. What was of topic, is, the burger's relevance and its construction as an anology to the 911's relevance and construction. No one argued where Porsche's are made.

That's not true. You cannot pust a catfish bewteen two pieces of bread and call it a hamburger. Again, you bring up irrelvant arguments.

The topic is Porsche's speculative move to a modular system. Who mentioned anything related to great cars before it? Again, one generation of a Vette that may or may not have industry success is not enough to alter the vision of Porsche. Sorry.

Wow. Google search? Really?

Sir, I've written published mainstream articles on every food I mentioned -- some even before Google was a 'thing'. (Yes, I'm that old.)

Let's just chalk this up to differences in analogous approach and application. Still standing by mine.

[48Laws]

Originally Posted by Viffermike

Wow. Google search? Really?

Sir, I've written published mainstream articles on every food I mentioned -- some even before Google was a 'thing'. (Yes, I'm that old.)

Let's just chalk this up to differences in analogous approach and application. Still standing by mine.

I can tell you’re a writer...hence the unprovoked long explanation of the origins of the hamburger, which showed you missed my point completely.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by 48Laws

Augmenting a burger, a la cheese etc, is not the same as changing the entire spirit behind what a burger is...which is, ground beef between to pieces of bread. In order for this to happen... a knew idea or concept would have to replace what a burger is. Occupy its space. That’s never happening and one generation of a Vette surely won’t affect the entire spirit behind Porsche’s legacy or their future.

Let's be precise (since Viffermike is)...

And I got your analogy right off the bat.

Turbo 4-cylinder boxer in a Cayman... blasphemy!

[48Laws]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Let's be precise (since Viffermike is)...

And I got your analogy right off the bat.

Turbo 4-cylinder boxer in a Cayman... blasphemy!

You have a twin turbo 6 in the M, though. Lol

[insanecoder]

So in the future the porsche 911 will just be the top-end audi?
hmmm
the evil that comes from saving costs .. loss of uniqueness
why? because it places constraints on the design of the car in question to fit the platform
great for servicing & manufacturing
less creative expression in both performance and body
boooooo