[Viktimize]

Originally Posted by jphughan

I'm not mad at all, I just don't see why you seem to feel that quoting everyone who disagrees with you and giving the same reply will change people's minds more than just making your point once.

The fact is that there's still a ton of information we don't know about the C7 Z06, much of which could have a major impact on its price (as I alluded to above), so it's not possible to accurately predict its price. But I do know that it's not reliable to predict a car's price based purely on how it's expected to perform overall relative to its predecessors, since there are MANY examples of newer generations of cars outperforming even uplevel versions of their predecessors while still being priced under the uplevel versions. It's also not reliable to predict price based purely on its power output figures. Ford delivered a 662 hp / 650 lb-ft Mustang for about $55K, which was shocking when it was announced. There's a lot more that goes into the cost of a car.

How can I expect all of those things to be added without the price going up? Well other than the blower, all of those things were added to the base C7 and its price didn't go up much, and that doesn't even take into account the dramatically better interior, comfort and convenience features, etc. Getting more for less is just how the market evolves.

And your entire second paragraph makes no sense. If it's unfair to compare the C6 Z06 to the C7 base, why is it fair to compare the C6 ZR1 to the C7 Z06? Also, the base C6 and Z06 are VERY far apart, arguably farther apart than the Z06 and ZR1. And if it's "pretty easy to let the tech trickle down for minimal cost" from the C6 Z06 to the C7 base without changing the base price of the latter much, why don't you think the same can happen with the C6 ZR1 tech down to the C7 Z06? They're "the same car" according to you, after all.

Time will tell I guess. Just a few days away and I am excited to see what they come to the table with. In the end price doesn't matter, because I still wouldn't buy this over the Viper no matter how cheap they made it. But if the performance is there and the price is reasonable, then maybe we will get to see an ACR Viper before the end of the year. With any luck I will be upgrading my 06 Viper to a 2014 TA next summer.

[swanson]

Scooped" from the '15 Z06 reveal:

- 8L90E 8-Speed Automatic available! Only 620+ hp car so equipped
- Steel torque tube replaced with woven c/f
- 60% more rigid chassis, with roof on, than C6 Z06
- 2.2" wider front track
- 3" wider rear track
- Wheel and tire sizes from C6 ZR1
- 3 levels, with varying degrees of aero downforce, with the Z07 version having more d/f than any production car GM's tested in their wind tunnel
- Compact 1.7L supercharger capable of 20,000 rpm and 9.5 psi of boost
- Pre-production versions set lap records @ Milford, beating ZR1 lap times

[MisterSkiMask]

shit, I think I want a corvette...

[Mavus]

Originally Posted by MisterSkiMask

shit, I think I want a corvette...

+1

it looks like engineers went nuts

[F1Venom]

So it'll have an auto option? At least they're not going full-retard like Porsche did with the 991 GT3.

[swanson]

[Tony135]

Not going to lie, this is the first time I'm considering an American car.

[hellrotm]

Originally Posted by MisterSkiMask

shit, I think I want a corvette...

No kidding, me too. This thing is beyond legit.

I am so past the Vette stereotyping now.

[basscadet]

Originally Posted by swanson

Scooped" from the '15 Z06 reveal:

- 8L90E 8-Speed Automatic available! Only 620+ hp car so equipped
- Steel torque tube replaced with woven c/f
- 60% more rigid chassis, with roof on, than C6 Z06
- 2.2" wider front track
- 3" wider rear track
- Wheel and tire sizes from C6 ZR1
- 3 levels, with varying degrees of aero downforce, with the Z07 version having more d/f than any production car GM's tested in their wind tunnel
- Compact 1.7L supercharger capable of 20,000 rpm and 9.5 psi of boost
- Pre-production versions set lap records @ Milford, beating ZR1 lap times

Where did you get this information??

[swanson]

Originally Posted by basscadet

Where did you get this information??

Corvette Forum.

[basscadet]

Huge fail if that car comes with a slushbox and not DCT!!

[swanson]

Originally Posted by basscadet

Huge fail if that car comes with a slushbox and not DCT!!

Listen, I REALLY, REALLY dont want to see an automatic in the new Z06. It will make it too accessible to too many posers. I know the DCT is coming as GM has filed for a patent for one. I dont know when it will be ready, but the process has started. We'll have to wait and see the full specs come Monday morning. I pray some of the rumors are false, but you never know.

[Viktimize]

Originally Posted by swanson

Listen, I REALLY, REALLY dont want to see an automatic in the new Z06. It will make it too accessible to too many posers. I know the DCT is coming as GM has filed for a patent for one. I dont know when it will be ready, but the process has started. We'll have to wait and see the full specs come Monday morning. I pray some of the rumors are false, but you never know.

Ya that would suck if it was so accessible like Lambo, Ferrari, Porsche, etc, with that DCT.

Don't get me wrong I hate anything but a true stick myself, but those DCT are just the way of the future. They shift faster, they are more efficient, and people are fucking lazy.

[swanson]

Originally Posted by Viktimize

Ya that would suck if it was so accessible like Labo, Ferrari, Porsche, etc, with that DCT.

Don't get me wrong I hate anything but a true stick myself, but those DCT are just the way of the future. They shift faster, they are more efficient, and people are fucking lazy.

I understand the DCT is faster. I had a 2011 M3 with a DCT and it shifted very fast. I would just like the Z06 to stay true to its roots. A lightweight, track oriented street car. What I meant by accessibility is that now guys that dont drive manuals because they "need" to be on their phones all the time or sipping their lattes or chai's will want to get the latest and greatest out there just to pose.

[Brunotheboxer]

No doubt about it this zo6 is gonna be the top dog. I say nicely equipped for close to 110k with a base price of about 85k.

Where does this car leave the zr1?

[Viktimize]

Originally Posted by swanson

I understand the DCT is faster. I had a 2011 M3 with a DCT and it shifted very fast. I would just like the Z06 to stay true to its roots. A lightweight, track oriented street car. What I meant by accessibility is that now guys that dont drive manuals because they "need" to be on their phones all the time or sipping their lattes or chai's will want to get the latest and greatest out there just to pose.

Like I said you already have guys doing that in Lambos and Ferraris. It just needs to be done to maintain sales. Not to mention they need to run transmissions like that to handle the all the power these cars are putting out now. Apparently the regular manual trans just won't hold up is what I have been reading.

[jphughan]

Originally Posted by Viktimize

Time will tell I guess. Just a few days away and I am excited to see what they come to the table with. In the end price doesn't matter, because I still wouldn't buy this over the Viper no matter how cheap they made it. But if the performance is there and the price is reasonable, then maybe we will get to see an ACR Viper before the end of the year. With any luck I will be upgrading my 06 Viper to a 2014 TA next summer.

I haven't driven either one, but owners I've talked to from both sides have agreed that the Viper is much more "raw" than a Corvette. An instructor who drove one of his student's Vipers described it as, "Like wrestling a bear." Plus apparently there's still a huge temperature gap between the footwell and the cabin area proper thanks to insufficient heat shielding from the engine down there. Since this would be my DD and track car, I'm not sure those are the elements I'd want. But if I were buying a pure track car, that might sway my choice. There's something primal about an 8.4L V10, especially in 2014.

Originally Posted by Tony135

Not going to lie, this is the first time I'm considering an American car.

+1, same here, and as an American I'm glad that day has finally come -- or for those older than 28, has come back.

Originally Posted by swanson

Listen, I REALLY, REALLY dont want to see an automatic in the new Z06. It will make it too accessible to too many posers.

How does a DCT keep more posers away than a slushbox? I hardly think that a "weirder" start from a stop than they're used to with a slushbox would be a dealbreaker for someone who really wanted to be a poser.

Originally Posted by swanson

I understand the DCT is faster. I had a 2011 M3 with a DCT and it shifted very fast. I would just like the Z06 to stay true to its roots. A lightweight, track oriented street car. What I meant by accessibility is that now guys that dont drive manuals because they "need" to be on their phones all the time or sipping their lattes or chai's will want to get the latest and greatest out there just to pose.

I'm betting manual is standard with DCT/auto as an option. I can't see the Corvette abandoning following the GT3 and going auto/DCT-only quite yet. If I were buying one, I too would get it in manual even though I go to the track and would therefore benefit from faster shifts. Still, the auto rev match feature should help close some of that gap, though I'd use it only on the track and enjoy the challenge of executing the perfect rev match by myself on the road. My experience with DCT thus far has indicated that FOR ME, while it delivers a thrill that 6MT can't quite match in the form of everything happening with such speed and immediacy (and thus allowing the brake-shift-turn in trifecta all happen much closer together), I could tell that I would get bored of it quickly -- plus that thrill only applies during hard driving. 6MT on the other hand FOR ME gives me fun during ALL driving by the constant challenge of executing perfectly smooth shifts and feeling like a total hero on the few times you get it just perfect because YOU were the one who did it. Plus I love the sensation of throttle-blipping our glorious S65, which isn't the same when I do it with my finger, and I imagine it will be at least as fun to blip the monstrous LT4 going into the Z06.

[thebishman]

Originally Posted by basscadet

Huge fail if that car comes with a slushbox and not DCT!!

The 'Auto' option will be the ZF 8 speed transmission that is essentially the same as the ZF SuperFast Auto in the Jag F Type. It changes gear in 100 ms which is about as quick as the best DCTs; has far better driveability at low speeds than most DCTs; is cheaper to build and no doubt repair; has a lock up on the TC from 2nd gear up; etc. What's not to like about this?
Look I love DCTs, and GM has filed a patent for a DCT using a TC in place of the clutch plates but if it's not the transmission that comes in the Z06, the ZF auto will do just fine, at least for me. The only question I have is will it suffer any heat soak issues on the road course in the summer?
Bish

[swanson]

Originally Posted by Brunotheboxer

No doubt about it this zo6 is gonna be the top dog. I say nicely equipped for close to 110k with a base price of about 85k.

Where does this car leave the zr1?

As of right now, there are no plans for a ZR1(thats what GM says)But I'm sure something will pop up in a few years.

Originally Posted by jphughan

I haven't driven either one, but owners I've talked to from both sides have agreed that the Viper is much more "raw" than a Corvette. An instructor who drove one of his student's Vipers described it as, "Like wrestling a bear." Plus apparently there's still a huge temperature gap between the footwell and the cabin area proper thanks to insufficient heat shielding from the engine down there. Since this would be my DD and track car, I'm not sure those are the elements I'd want. But if I were buying a pure track car, that might sway my choice. There's something primal about an 8.4L V10, especially in 2014.



+1, same here, and as an American I'm glad that day has finally come -- or for those older than 28, has come back.



How does a DCT keep more posers away than a slushbox? I hardly think that a "weirder" start from a stop than they're used to with a slushbox would be a dealbreaker for someone who really wanted to be a poser.



I'm betting manual is standard with DCT/auto as an option. I can't see the Corvette abandoning following the GT3 and going auto/DCT-only quite yet. If I were buying one, I too would get it in manual even though I go to the track and would therefore benefit from faster shifts. Still, the auto rev match feature should help close some of that gap, though I'd use it only on the track and enjoy the challenge of executing the perfect rev match by myself on the road. My experience with DCT thus far has indicated that FOR ME, while it delivers a thrill that 6MT can't quite match in the form of everything happening with such speed and immediacy (and thus allowing the brake-shift-turn in trifecta all happen much closer together), I could tell that I would get bored of it quickly -- plus that thrill only applies during hard driving. 6MT on the other hand FOR ME gives me fun during ALL driving by the constant challenge of executing perfectly smooth shifts and feeling like a total hero on the few times you get it just perfect because YOU were the one who did it. Plus I love the sensation of throttle-blipping our glorious S65, which isn't the same when I do it with my finger, and I imagine it will be at least as fun to blip the monstrous LT4 going into the Z06.

Right now, the rumor is both a manual and the new ZF 8speed auto. No DCT. We will know everything by Monday morning. I'll keep everyone posted as I hear things.

[quagmire]

The automatic will be their own 8L90 that GM has developed which is not a DCT most likely.

[Viktimize]

Originally Posted by jphughan

I haven't driven either one, but owners I've talked to from both sides have agreed that the Viper is much more "raw" than a Corvette. An instructor who drove one of his student's Vipers described it as, "Like wrestling a bear." Plus apparently there's still a huge temperature gap between the footwell and the cabin area proper thanks to insufficient heat shielding from the engine down there. Since this would be my DD and track car, I'm not sure those are the elements I'd want. But if I were buying a pure track car, that might sway my choice. There's something primal about an 8.4L V10, especially in 2014.

I definitely haven't heard any footwell heat issues from anyone in the club yet?? Even on my Gen3 that is all but eliminated by just pulling the cats out. The main problem that gave them the cabin heat was having an exhaust crossover run under the seats. That was eliminated in the Gen4's when a straight through exhaust was ran right out the side sills.

Track use is where the Viper shines. It's an N/A engine making as much power as the new Vette is doing with a S/C. The guys that road course theirs would not trade it for anything. The TA is getting all kinds of praise in the media as well.

If I had cash for a strictly track car, I would keep my Viper for street use, and buy a 2006 Z06 for track. A few tweaks on that thing and you have a very capable track rat.

[jphughan]

Originally Posted by Viktimize

I definitely haven't heard any footwell heat issues from anyone in the club yet?? Even on my Gen3 that is all but eliminated by just pulling the cats out. The main problem that gave them the cabin heat was having an exhaust crossover run under the seats. That was eliminated in the Gen4's when a straight through exhaust was ran right out the side sills.

Track use is where the Viper shines. It's an N/A engine making as much power as the new Vette is doing with a S/C. The guys that road course theirs would not trade it for anything. The TA is getting all kinds of praise in the media as well.

If I had cash for a strictly track car, I would keep my Viper for street use, and buy a 2006 Z06 for track. A few tweaks on that thing and you have a very capable track rat.

So wait, you tell me all about how the Viper shines on the track and how the road course people wouldn't have anything else, and then you say you'd keep yours as a purely road car? Seems like it would make more sense to convert the Viper into a full track monster and keep a Corvette for the street since both Corvette and Viper forums seem to agree that the Viper is closer to a track car to start and the Corvette more livable on the street -- although either way you'd be wasting a lot of a great car's potential, which is why I probably wouldn't consider owning both a Z06 and my current M3 even if I decided I could afford to do so.