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      10-11-2019, 12:14 AM   #67
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Originally Posted by 535i MSport View Post
I am not sure it does make sense. Who wants the "almost" car?
I would, depending on which M vehicle is in question. I'm not in the market for an M8 at all but I'm considering an X3 M and I would 100% go for the non-competition version especially because I prefer the base X3 M wheels styling a LOT, love the fact that they're an inch smaller diameter, and I can live without the last bit of handling sharpness and the other upgrades in an SUV that already handles like M SUVs do. I always do a tune and exhaust upgrade so no sense paying extra to have those mildly upgraded and then thrown away.

The fact that BMW allows you to option the upgraded seats into the non-competition model is perfect for me.

I don't care if it's an "almost" model, I'm not spending this much of my paycheck to drive an M car for anybody else, I get the variant that suits my needs the best at the time and right now it seems like in some cases the non-Competition model suits me better. If I was looking at an M5, the M5 Competition is 100% for me, wheels are amazing, the ride is extremely comfortable (compared to my F80 M3 ZCP, anyways), and I appreciate the subtle handling upgrades in that model.
Interesting.

In the UK you get an X3M C only, an M5 C only, and X5M C only, you get the idea.

So celebrate the fact you get a choice, you may not forever!
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      10-11-2019, 12:44 AM   #68
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Originally Posted by 535i MSport View Post
Interesting.

In the UK you get an X3M C only, an M5 C only, and X5M C only, you get the idea.

So celebrate the fact you get a choice, you may not forever!
What is interesting to me is just how much that has changed. Our cars were always really highly specced, our F13 M6s had just about everything, the options were pretty much what wheel style you wanted, Carbon Ceramics, B&O and colour.

I can't find a UK order guide at the moment but going off an American list to jog my memory, the things that we got standard that weren't standard in the UK were things like:

hud
soft close doors
acoustic glass
ventilated seats
comfort access
comfort seats
full led headlights
surround view cameras
rear camera
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      10-11-2019, 12:50 AM   #69
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Interesting.

In the UK you get an X3M C only, an M5 C only, and X5M C only, you get the idea.

So celebrate the fact you get a choice, you may not forever!
What is interesting to me is just how much that has changed. Our cars were always really highly specced, our F13 M6s had just about everything, the options were pretty much what wheel style you wanted, Carbon Ceramics, B&O and colour.

I can't find a UK order guide at the moment but going off an American list to jog my memory, the things that we got standard that weren't standard in the UK were things like:

hud
soft close doors
acoustic glass
ventilated seats
comfort access
comfort seats
full led headlights
surround view cameras
rear camera
connected drive
full leather
speed limit info
driving assistance (blind spot, lane keep, etc)
rear sunshade
Absolutely. There are huge differences in what BMW "country", decide to make standard in a particular car. I guess this allows them to "tune" the model for a particular market place.

In the days of the E60, the U.K. MSport model was only available with the MSport body kit for example.
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      10-11-2019, 07:18 AM   #70
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Check my post above. Base vs base, an M8 is ~$31k more than an M5. That's still a lot, but it certainly isn't $60k.

Also, the Competition Package on the M3/M4 was $4,750, and gave you 20hp, M Sport exhaust, revised front steering, revised suspension, revised rear diff, the 20" wheels, M seat belts, and extended shadowline trim.

The Competition version of the M8 gives you 17hp, peak torque 160rpm higher, revised suspension, stiffer engine mounts, more front negative camber, rear toe-link ball joints to replace bushings, M Sport exhaust, a "Track" setting for in-car electronics and driving aids, M seat belts, and different wheels.

For the sake of comparison, the Competition Package for the M6 was $8,300 and included similar upgrades. These same improvements on a much faster car with much higher levels of tech will cost more, but with this car competing a bit more upmarket, even further cost increase might have made sense to the company.
How can you revise a suspension system when the car has just been released? That just means, they made the 'Standard' M8 suspension worse than it should have been and then if you pay a bit more, you get what you should've got in the first place.

So sad how BMW are now selling out their customers like this.
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      10-11-2019, 01:02 PM   #71
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How can you revise a suspension system when the car has just been released? That just means, they made the 'Standard' M8 suspension worse than it should have been and then if you pay a bit more, you get what you should've got in the first place.

So sad how BMW are now selling out their customers like this.
Better or Worse versus stiffer or softer or more compliant isnít the same thing
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      10-11-2019, 06:46 PM   #72
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      10-12-2019, 01:35 AM   #73
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I know I'm not the target market for this car, but with a $200k budget, my money would be on a 6MT 991 GT3 and an Accord sedan (...or Ford Explorer) IF I had a family. Sans the family, it would be a 6MT GT3 and a keep my ///M4 and C320 beater.
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      10-12-2019, 02:23 AM   #74
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I think BMW's have taken a page from MB book. They seem to be more leasing type of vehicles than ownership. I would rather wait 2-3 years to pick one of these up. Plan on keeping GT3 for the long haul.
Very few of the AMG GT 63's will be leased given the horrendous MF for big AMG's. More that double that of BMW.
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      10-12-2019, 02:32 AM   #75
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I know I'm not the target market for this car, but with a $200k budget, my money would be on a 6MT 991 GT3 and an Accord sedan (...or Ford Explorer) IF I had a family. Sans the family, it would be a 6MT GT3 and a keep my ///M4 and C320 beater.
The biggest issue with the car is that is looks nowhere near its price tag.
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      10-12-2019, 10:43 AM   #76
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Honestly unless you are in the market and have driven it you would not understand. Shmee gets it given its abilities and what the competition offers. It is a fantastic car, highly capable and easy to drive daily. Not true of a 911 GT3 which is a great track car and horrible daily driver. And yes I have driven them all including the new M8 and for me it's a perfect daily driver for a 100 mile round trip commute. Safe and fast and very capable. Very reliable with typical BMW service. Yes a M5 comp can do more for less but that is not the point. I have a large family car and most of the time I am the only one in it. Porsche makes great sports cars and decent SUVs but I love the BMW service and reliability. The M8 should cost less, probably $20k less but understand this is a low volume car with a lot of expensive technology. The carbon core chassis for example.

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      10-12-2019, 12:09 PM   #77
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Honestly unless you are in the market and have driven it you would not understand. Shmee gets it given its abilities and what the competition offers. It is a fantastic car, highly capable and easy to drive daily. Not true of a 911 GT3 which is a great track car and horrible daily driver. And yes I have driven them all including the new M8 and for me it's a perfect daily driver for a 100 mile round trip commute. Safe and fast and very capable. Very reliable with typical BMW service. Yes a M5 comp can do more for less but that is not the point. I have a large family car and most of the time I am the only one in it. Porsche makes great sports cars and decent SUVs but I love the BMW service and reliability. The M8 should cost less, probably $20k less but understand this is a low volume car with a lot of expensive technology. The carbon core chassis for example.

Noushy
Depending on who you are, your specific needs, and where you live, a GT3 may not be a horrible daily driver. Blanket statements are absent nuance.
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      10-12-2019, 12:11 PM   #78
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Honestly unless you are in the market and have driven it you would not understand. Shmee gets it given its abilities and what the competition offers. It is a fantastic car, highly capable and easy to drive daily. Not true of a 911 GT3 which is a great track car and horrible daily driver. And yes I have driven them all including the new M8 and for me it's a perfect daily driver for a 100 mile round trip commute. Safe and fast and very capable. Very reliable with typical BMW service. Yes a M5 comp can do more for less but that is not the point. I have a large family car and most of the time I am the only one in it. Porsche makes great sports cars and decent SUVs but I love the BMW service and reliability. The M8 should cost less, probably $20k less but understand this is a low volume car with a lot of expensive technology. The carbon core chassis for example.

Noushy
Depending on who you are, your specific needs, and where you live, a GT3 may not be a horrible daily driver. Blanket statements are absent nuance.
In Michigan with bad roads as most of the northern states it is awful. Granted in Florida or Cali with smooth roads different. But no arguing the M8 is a better daily driver. The GT3 will jar your fillings loose.

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      10-12-2019, 12:15 PM   #79
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
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Originally Posted by noushy View Post
Honestly unless you are in the market and have driven it you would not understand. Shmee gets it given its abilities and what the competition offers. It is a fantastic car, highly capable and easy to drive daily. Not true of a 911 GT3 which is a great track car and horrible daily driver. And yes I have driven them all including the new M8 and for me it's a perfect daily driver for a 100 mile round trip commute. Safe and fast and very capable. Very reliable with typical BMW service. Yes a M5 comp can do more for less but that is not the point. I have a large family car and most of the time I am the only one in it. Porsche makes great sports cars and decent SUVs but I love the BMW service and reliability. The M8 should cost less, probably $20k less but understand this is a low volume car with a lot of expensive technology. The carbon core chassis for example.

Noushy
Depending on who you are, your specific needs, and where you live, a GT3 may not be a horrible daily driver. Blanket statements are absent nuance.
In Michigan with bad roads as most of the northern states it is awful. Granted in Florida or Cali with smooth roads different. But no arguing the M8 is a better daily driver. The GT3 will jar your fillings loose.

Noushy
The two elders that live in my city in SoCal daily drive their GT3's and so does the little Asian lady with the green GT3 that lives in the Estates. Their fillings seem fine, as do their vertebrae.

I get the overall point you're trying to make, but my point is everybody is different. People here can't even agree on whether an M3/M4 is fit [or not] for daily driving with some screaming it's perfect while others call it too jarring (...maybe they should check their fillings!!!).
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      10-12-2019, 12:18 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by noushy View Post
Honestly unless you are in the market and have driven it you would not understand. Shmee gets it given its abilities and what the competition offers. It is a fantastic car, highly capable and easy to drive daily. Not true of a 911 GT3 which is a great track car and horrible daily driver. And yes I have driven them all including the new M8 and for me it's a perfect daily driver for a 100 mile round trip commute. Safe and fast and very capable. Very reliable with typical BMW service. Yes a M5 comp can do more for less but that is not the point. I have a large family car and most of the time I am the only one in it. Porsche makes great sports cars and decent SUVs but I love the BMW service and reliability. The M8 should cost less, probably $20k less but understand this is a low volume car with a lot of expensive technology. The carbon core chassis for example.

Noushy
Depending on who you are, your specific needs, and where you live, a GT3 may not be a horrible daily driver. Blanket statements are absent nuance.
In Michigan with bad roads as most of the northern states it is awful. Granted in Florida or Cali with smooth roads different. But no arguing the M8 is a better daily driver. The GT3 will jar your fillings loose.

Noushy
The two elders that live in my city in SoCal daily drive their GT3's and so does the little Asian lady with the green GT3 that lives in the Estates. Their fillings seem fine, as do their vertebrae.
Again Cali vs Michigan. I have driven them both no argument the BMW is more comfortable better daily driver. If you were saying a Regular 911 maybe more so but the GT3 as all Porsche GT cars is engineered for the track. Terrible daily driver in Michigan. Enough said.
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      10-12-2019, 12:20 PM   #81
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Honestly unless you are in the market and have driven it you would not understand. Shmee gets it given its abilities and what the competition offers. It is a fantastic car, highly capable and easy to drive daily. Not true of a 911 GT3 which is a great track car and horrible daily driver. And yes I have driven them all including the new M8 and for me it's a perfect daily driver for a 100 mile round trip commute. Safe and fast and very capable. Very reliable with typical BMW service. Yes a M5 comp can do more for less but that is not the point. I have a large family car and most of the time I am the only one in it. Porsche makes great sports cars and decent SUVs but I love the BMW service and reliability. The M8 should cost less, probably $20k less but understand this is a low volume car with a lot of expensive technology. The carbon core chassis for example.

Noushy
Depending on who you are, your specific needs, and where you live, a GT3 may not be a horrible daily driver. Blanket statements are absent nuance.
In Michigan with bad roads as most of the northern states it is awful. Granted in Florida or Cali with smooth roads different. But no arguing the M8 is a better daily driver. The GT3 will jar your fillings loose.

Noushy
The two elders that live in my city in SoCal daily drive their GT3's and so does the little Asian lady with the green GT3 that lives in the Estates. Their fillings seem fine, as do their vertebrae.
Again Cali vs Michigan. I have driven them both no argument the BMW is more comfortable better daily driver. If you were saying a Regular 911 maybe more so but the GT3 as all Porsche GT cars is engineered for the track. Terrible daily driver in Michigan. Enough said.
Read my edit. You're making my point.....which is, a GT3, for example, isn't a horrible daily driver for everybody, so we should stay away from blanket statements since everybody's situation is different.
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      10-12-2019, 08:20 PM   #82
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There is nobody with 200k to spend on a car that has the m8 on their list. That my friends is why this fails.
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      10-13-2019, 08:35 AM   #83
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There is nobody with 200k to spend on a car that has the m8 on their list. That my friends is why this fails.
I would say this is mostly true but a well equipped M8 comp is actually more like $155-160 before discounts and lease incentives. Similar priced Porsche will lease for much more given Porsche MF and residuals.

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      10-13-2019, 01:39 PM   #84
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Honestly unless you are in the market and have driven it you would not understand. Shmee gets it given its abilities and what the competition offers. It is a fantastic car, highly capable and easy to drive daily. Not true of a 911 GT3 which is a great track car and horrible daily driver. And yes I have driven them all including the new M8 and for me it's a perfect daily driver for a 100 mile round trip commute. Safe and fast and very capable. Very reliable with typical BMW service. Yes a M5 comp can do more for less but that is not the point. I have a large family car and most of the time I am the only one in it. Porsche makes great sports cars and decent SUVs but I love the BMW service and reliability. The M8 should cost less, probably $20k less but understand this is a low volume car with a lot of expensive technology. The carbon core chassis for example.

Noushy
Depending on who you are, your specific needs, and where you live, a GT3 may not be a horrible daily driver. Blanket statements are absent nuance.
In Michigan with bad roads as most of the northern states it is awful. Granted in Florida or Cali with smooth roads different. But no arguing the M8 is a better daily driver. The GT3 will jar your fillings loose.

Noushy
The two elders that live in my city in SoCal daily drive their GT3's and so does the little Asian lady with the green GT3 that lives in the Estates. Their fillings seem fine, as do their vertebrae.
Again Cali vs Michigan. I have driven them both no argument the BMW is more comfortable better daily driver. If you were saying a Regular 911 maybe more so but the GT3 as all Porsche GT cars is engineered for the track. Terrible daily driver in Michigan. Enough said.
Read my edit. You're making my point.....which is, a GT3, for example, isn't a horrible daily driver for everybody, so we should stay away from blanket statements since everybody's situation is different.
Just being clear not a blanket statement. But a M3/M4 is a very specific market. In the sports sedan/coupe arena they are one of the best. People don't buy them for ride quality. If you want that there is the M340i. AMG and Audi Sport know this as well. The M8 is a very small market niche for high end luxury Gt cars like the Aston Martin or Maserati GT or MB S coupe. I agree with your last post I missed the final line sorry hard to read on a phone. Just tired of people comparing them to the 911 which really is a different market, it's a sports car. You could argue the Nissa GTR as well given a loaded Nismo is over $150k and terrible dealer support and service. The BMW M8 is going after a different market than the 911. It has a bigger and real trunk vs. a frunk and bigger back seats but still basically unusable.

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      10-13-2019, 02:58 PM   #85
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I'm buying one now and I'm not a sucker. I know what I like and I like this car. I don't have to wait to buy what I want just to save a few thousand dollars. You enjoy buying at a price and I enjoy buying what I want.
Congrats on your purchase. Life is short and if you can afford it, buy it. But in 4 years, this will be 50K (assuming 40-50k miles). That is more than just a few thousand dollars.
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      10-13-2019, 05:44 PM   #86
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Read my edit. You're making my point.....which is, a GT3, for example, isn't a horrible daily driver for everybody, so we should stay away from blanket statements since everybody's situation is different.
I drive my GT3 a lot, but it would depend on roads and whether or not the car has lwb seats.

That being said, I am still not convinced by the m8. And forget the gt3, the 911 gts, the mclaren 570s, MB, Aston, etc all have legitimate competition.
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      10-13-2019, 05:47 PM   #87
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Read my edit. You're making my point.....which is, a GT3, for example, isn't a horrible daily driver for everybody, so we should stay away from blanket statements since everybody's situation is different.
I drive my GT3 a lot, but it would depend on roads and whether or not the car has lwb seats.

That being said, I am still not convinced by the m8. And forget the gt3, the 911 gts, the mclaren 570s, MB, Aston, etc all have legitimate competition.
My good man! It makes me happy to hear that.
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